Claire

Finally I agree with you grumble bum LOL! Yes it is disgusting and it wasnt a mistake he had made the choice to rape dani, no one forced him. How could rape be a mistake? He knew what he was doing and comitted a horrific crime. Kane deserves what he gets in life, not only has he mainpulative kristy all these years, raped dani, and not to mention all those robberies he's committed. I dont like kane never have and never will and kristy was pathetic for falling for him in the first place. She can do so much better, it was a relief she got with miles but a bummer that she broke off the relationship with him. Out of interest, did either of you watch back in 2001/2 and see the rape in its context? The final mediation session between he and Dani in 2002 is particularly interesting to watch, and sums up nicely Kane's state of mind at the time. "Mistake" was the word for it. Although the relationship came out of left field, it didn't stop many people sympathising with all characters involved in the story. It was an incredibly well-written story, and although the concept makes people critical, it was written and executed very carefully and respectfully. The good things Kane has done certainly outweigh the bad, but unfortunately it's the bad that people seem to remember more. Same with everything that he has been through - people seem to forget everything he's had to put up with and simply categorise him as the "baddie". He's not a one-dimensional character, and I hate people portraying him to be.

Agreed, Kirsty has become boring and she irritates me these days. She used to be quite a feisty character but since hooking up with Miles it's like she's aged rapidly and become middle-aged overnight. Wholeheartedly agree that Miles was not good her the character, but also that she damaged his as well. Miles' his former role as a loveable guy with larger-than-life hair and a laid back and slightly kid-like attitude to life was much better than the role he is playing as Kirsty's other half, where he has lost so much of his likeability. They shouldn't have tied a character like him into a serious relationship like that. And Kirsty has become worryingly hated in the process, considering how popular she was when she left the show (the rape debate having been dead and buried a number of years ago and I don't see much point in re-hashing that). Miles has brought her down, and tied her into the role of mother-hen. She used to be carefree, spirited and yes, she has always been a bit selfish and has lied to protect herself / her family (I would say this makes her all the more fascinating, none of that holier-than-thou act that many characters are confined to). However, I can't really fathom why that's the reason everyone states for 'hating' her, when other characters have so many more flaws and have hurt more people (the overrated Aden and Belle pairing are hardly saints). Kirsty was always much more likeable with Kane, perhaps because they were a better match personality-wise. They didn't bring each other down, but complimented one another's character. Whereas Kirsty has been forced to grow up waaay too quickly with Miles, she and Kane were on the same wavelength from the start.

On that note, I think it would have done them more justice had Kirsty decided to go back to Kane before he died but never got around to splitting with Miles before. Think it would have worked better than Kirsty rejecting him then killing him. Would have stayed truer to the romance to have her want to go back to him. The writers could have done that, and I'm inclined to say that they would have done if they were *really* killing him off. I can't see how Kirsty sticking on the show AND being with Kane would work... unless Sam returned to the role part time and Kane got a job that involved being away a bit (someone mentioned boat charters not long ago). But that would worry me, as the writers would take the obvious route of introducing some male to try and woo Kirsty with Kane away. Didn't think Christie's position was confirmed yet - whether she's becoming permanent cast again... if so, I reckon she'll appear on the first set of 2009 credits.

Couldn't agree more. KK are a couple I've always been very attached to... remember watching them first getting together when I was doing my GCSEs... and look at me now... a postgrad. Now that's scary. But I feel I've grown up with the couple - they're very much a classic H&A couple. So much chemistry and so many obstacles they overcame together. I heard they were returning, and was stoked and so pleased that they may finally get their 'happy ending' - don't get me wrong, I thought going on the run was very 'them' and was a fitting ending, but it was bittersweet to think that although the family would stay together, they'd have to give up everything else. But then the return happened, and it just seemed to tear apart the very roots of KK. I can understand Kane giving Kirsty up when he went to jail and asking her to forget about him. Cruel to be kind, again, although I struggle with why he chose not to appeal sooner. What I can't comprehend in the slightest is how Kirsty has been able to move on so quickly with Miles, and how she could even consider staying with Miles over Kane. Sure, she's happy enough with Miles, but with Kane it was so much more than that - they were a perfect match from the outset, and spent so long fighting to be together. I feel they've tried to adapt the character of Kirsty since she came back to make her more compatible with Miles... but it just doesn't work. I know people are saying "oh, she was never happy with Kane, she'll have a much better life with Miles", but I think that the people that say that don't realise that it was never being with Kane that meant she had a 'bad' time of it - one can hardly blame him for her kidney complications, miscarriage, Kane's cancer, his father setting him up etc. And if we look at the season finale of 2005, I think we can glimpse that happiness of KK between dramas So yeah, I believe she can be equally 'happy', if not more so with Kane.

Makes perfect sense, and I share your opinion on all of the above points about 'acceptable' posts... I certainly don't have a problem with that (although I do think clarification on the matter will have been useful for some members). The only issue I have is the means of enforcement which I think could be less extreme and more member-friendly (so as to encourage posting, rather than to 'deter' it - although I realise that is absolutely not the intention; it's just a possible side-effect, however much clarification is given on acceptable posts) SPAM and spag can be, and has been in the past, an issue across all forums, and I believe it can be ironed out in the same way via moderation. It seems to me that the only forum-specific issue (and thus the only justification for having the mod approval requirement) is the character/actor abuse that was taking place. I guess I just struggle to accept that mod-approval is the only way of solving the problem - is it intended as a permanent move, or a temp-fix until a better solution is found? Just my two-cents on the matter... hope discussions in Staffghanistan are fruitful

Appreciated There doesn't seem to be an easy solution for this one The forum just seems a bit dead, and the need for approval makes members seem censored. Personally, I don't really like the thought of something having to be looked over and given the nod before it is 'allowed' to appear on the forum. I know that mods won't be laying a finger on most posts, and all intentions are good, but I reckon it's still making people less likely to post, or making them think twice about posting something. Which isn't really what this forum is about. I can't help but feel that there are better alternatives to be experimented with before resorting to mod approval. Perhaps by increasing moderation in the forum, increasing official warnings and making use of temp bans for the worst offenders? (obviously I don't know exactly the level of personal warnings / member torture (!) going on 'behind the scenes') Is it possible to restrict someone's posting ability in one forum? If so, it could be utilised to 'ban' people from posting in that one forum for a while. Or possibly the creation of a new user group to stick the offenders into that prevents them from accessing/posting in the forum.

I do understand and agree with the reasoning behind the recent revamp of the Character Appreciation Forum, as things were getting quite out of control, but is mod approval for every post really necessary? I didn't realise that the trouble in the forum was that serious to warrant it? The main problem seemed to be , in my opinion, the abuse that was taking place - the spam, SPAG and chitchat didn't seem to be a forum-specific issue and was more a secondary concern, and I feel the abuse could be dealt with via less extreme methods. Why not simply issue warnings against offending members instead of impacting on everyone? I do think that appreciation of relationships could include general 'chitchat', particularly discussions between hardcore fans that mightn't be 'understood' in other areas of the Board - I feel it may be a bonus to have a 'safe haven' for fans to discuss / chitchat about relationships such as Adelle - random, little things that have been picked up on in various scenes). I'm not a big Adelle fan, or JM, or any of the mainsteam H&A couples at the moment (all will probably know my loyalties to Kane and Kirsty), but I do feel that I can say things over at KK.com that I wouldn't want to say in episode discussion / spoiler discussion over here. Little things that only the shippers really pick up on, and you don;t really want all the anti-KK people to start attacking (yep, all those little obsessive things ). Though I do see how it could be hard to distinguish between this and 'normal' episode and spoiler discussion. There is of course also the 'inconvenience' of posting in a mod-approval forum when there are no mods online (such as now ). I recognise that this will always be the case at some point, all mods having lives outside of BTTB, but it is perhaps slightly irritating, particularly as it was the minority that were causing the problems.

Irene and Barry were such a good match... of all the men that we've seen Irene with over the years, she and Barry fitted so perfectly. I'll admit I wasn't watching in those later days, and when Barry left H&A, but I saw the foundations of their relationship and there was something special there. It's just a shame it didn't last - after all, I think Irene needs a solid love interest. She seems to spend her life trying to sort other people's problems/relationships out!

Also the first fic I've read in ages... and one of the most moving Beautiful... I do wish that we'd heard more about their lives as a young family before they came back to the Bay on screen, and love how you've written Ollie's memories of his father here - it has crossed my mind that with him being so young, his father will soon become a distant memory... nice to 'see inside' their heads like this Goes without saying I'd love to see more like this - have always loved your style of writing, ILM.

Beautiful! Never realised the final chapters were on here, but a pleasant surprise when I came searching! FD seems to be playing up! Gorgeous ending, although I do feel for Claire... it was all unfair on her, and harshly done with the baby, but KK are soulmates after all

I don't read many fics that aren't KK - I don't really feel able to get 'into' them... but this fic gets a thumbs-up from me! Nice work!

His Aunt attended the 2001 court case with him... he mentioned an Aunt when he and Kirsty were out in the bush (how he couldn't go stay with her without his Dad dragging him back) and I'm pretty sure he was staying with his Aunt in 2002 when they got together (also, Kirsty called her when trying to contact him after he dumped her)... in 2003, he made a comment that staying with his aunt 'wasn't an option' Really looking forward to more fic from you, Ash. ETA: And feel free to use the same names as I have in my fics

I think the latter Valk somehow!!!. Gosh Des you wasting the best years of you life. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hell, no. Uni is THE best time of your life... though I guess school is a bit of a must if you want to get there... Never thought much of school, but boy am I glad I stuck it out for 14 years...