Latest UK Episode Discussion (2006-2017 Seasons)

[Red Ranger 1]

Then Red, doubted "we wouldn't be here if not for them" We never know how true that was/will be, but I certainly feel that the world might not be as stable and peaceful as we know it now (and not just UK and Australia) if these countries had not gone to war. As Harold used to say in Neighbours ; "It only takes good men to do nothing, to allow bad men to prevail". Yes I believe that really is the case and I am proud of the fact that our country has gone to the aid of others so many times in our history. We have made a difference,

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Regarding your other point, I know it wasn't addressed at me but I think you're right.  The reason why Britain is stable is because they fought the axis powers in WW1 and WW2 more specifically Germany and Japan.  So you could argue the soldiers giving their lives has ensured the freedom of people in this generation.  In the case with Australia I think again fighting against the Japanese ensured the stability of their country.  There's also the argument with WW2 that the US/USSR probably could have handled it themselves but it's a different subject altogether.

​We're getting way off topic here and moving into areas we should probably be steering clear of.But I notice that you yourself Slade queried the worthiness of the Vietnam War.And I did actually say Brian that some wars had made things better for someone, and I agree that going to the aid of others is something to be proud of, but that's a completely different thing to saying that the folks back at home wouldn't be there.I doubt many people would argue we should have stayed out of WW2, same as I doubt that things would have played out differently if we'd left it for others to get involved.But WW1? There was no Axis powers then, the Japanese were our allies, the Germans were designated villains who frankly were no worse than us and were just fighting for their country same as we were, and the issues involved were practically non-existent, just a local conflict that escalated when a series of bluffs got called.It's hard to think of any real positive effects of it and there were plenty of negatives one.Including WW2.

[CaptainHulk]

Back on topic, The focus on Alf and this storyline is awakening some new promise in the show I haven't seen in a good while, I may be tempted to start back on 5* pace (which I haven't done since "The Murder").

[atrus]

An excellent episode on Friday, I thought. Not only because Alf had a decent storyline but because it really brought H&A back to what it always did well: that rookie-mentor relationship between the older characters and the youngsters, and all the natural conflicts that the generation gap brings. So often these days the teens are just hooking up and breaking up and doing little else in between, so it was great to see this plot used as a means of exploring each of the younger characters in a bit more depth, as well as Alf himself and of course marking the Anzac centenary. I'm glad to see they're stretching it out a bit too, and it looks as if we'll be getting a fair bit more next week as the night in the trenches goes ahead.

Regarding the politics of it all, I too am cynical about sweeping statements regarding what we owe to the heroes of the past. The world is infinitely more complicated than that, and that idea of 'our boys keeping us safe', while true in some contexts (I think WW2 is the example that most springs to mind), is unfortunately used to retrospectively whitewash any war a government chooses to fight, just or unjust, by attempting to link our natural concern/respect for our soldiers with some kind of moral judgement about the role they play always being righteous. When in my view it's far from always righteous. I'm not saying we shouldn't remember, and god forbid we should ever dismiss any war as irrelevant. But it's important also to bear in mind that it's easy with hindsight for the winning side in a war to attribute very altruistic motivations to everyone involved - when the truth is that the motivation for war is always complex, often murky and almost invariably involves a large helping of economic self-interest that doesn't necessarily justify the means. Humanitarian benefits might be a welcome side-effect; but conversely, as in Iraq, military intervention can end up making things immeasurably worse for the people in these places. Meanwhile back at home, we face an unprecedented level of threat from domestic terrorism - and no-one will ever convince me that that isn't a direct upshot of the UK wading into Afghanistan and Iraq, however many times Tony Blair tries to argue otherwise. This is why I'm a bit wary, when marking anniversaries of past conflicts, of clubbing all those conflicts together at memorials etc with the blanket message of 'look at the good our military does'.

Back with H&A, that's why I particularly loved the way they set up Evie as the conscientious objector - it isn't just that she's apathetic (though it's true to say she is) - it's also that she has a principled view about armed conflict, which is in many respects quite valid. And yet this episode showed how she could also come to appreciate the human aspect of soldiers' suffering and sacrifice, through seeing how it had affected Alf. All in all, it was a very powerful and I think responsible way to approach the storyline. Like Evie, you can be cynical about war and still empathise with those who fought it.

The Maddy storyline was also good, as again it set up a conflict in which we could sympathise with both sides - I can understand why Tanya was angry that Roo didn't come to her about the cancer, but also felt for Roo as she was only trying to do the right thing by Maddy.

Not a Braxton in sight, incidentally. Not being glib, but it does underline the fact that the show can excel without them, and shouldn't feel it needs to depend on them to create great drama.

[Angelica]

It is interesting to see all your thoughts here about the war theme. I didn't get schooled in the UK, so I am interested to hear, Slade, that WW1 doesn't get taught until GCSE, and WW2 until A-level. As I found the children's attitude quite alien, as certainly at my school, WW1, and even more so, WW2 were the times in history class when a lot of people actually seemed genuinely interested - due to a combination of having grandparents who may have been children (or even fought) during WW2, and the ubiquity of war based films. So it is interesting to hear other people's experiences.

I thought they did a good job of trying to show two sides of the story without having a political agenda. While I did like Marilyn's little rant at the kids, I did find the degree of their  transformation from callous and disinterested to exceedingly touched perhaps a bit hard to buy. .I thought that the most when it came to Evie - while she did have a couple of lines about objecting to war, it still felt like Evie's reluctance came from disinterest and ennuie. So I found the scene where she was in tears, just felt really false and quite forced. I thought some of the others' realisation panned out better.

Thought it might have been better to have saved the Maddy scenes for the next episode, and kept Friday's episode solely about the war memorial. However, I am glad that Maddy's mum knows. And props to the make up artists for at least attempting to make Maddy look like someone who is sick.

[Homeandawayfan.]

Another good episode, I am noticing a gradual improvement, at least in balance of characters. Scenes of Roo and Irene and Leah just chatting, being, in the diner is good. It is good that Neighbours and H&A have characters who were in Vietnam such Jim Robinson, Tom Ramsay and Jeff Richards and in H&A, Tom Fletcher, Danny King and Alf Stewart. There are probably a few more.

[Red Ranger 1]

Re:Evelyn, I'm in agreement with Angelica here:Despite Oscar's conscientious objector jokes and a few anti-war comments, it seemed more a case of her not wanting to be there and grumbling about anything rather than having any firmly held political beliefs.Whether that makes her turnaround more or less realistic is a matter of opinion, I guess.

Anyway, today.Could have done without an idiotic brawl between Josh and Oscar at the start, or the unlikelihood of no-one caring about Josh and Evelyn snuggling under a blanket on a school trip (what, are co-ed dorms a thing now?), but it was nice to have a scene between Matt and Oscar, especially since the latter felt like a glorified extra last week, and their odd friendship still seems to be going strong.Jett also continues to impress as he takes charge to a certain extent.It was possibly not a good idea to take Alf out there given his frame of mind, it was a bit too close to home, but I suppose he did have the opportunity to back out.(Not sure if they told him about the guns and bombs, though.)Still, it finally seemed to teach the group about teamwork and those scenes were very affecting.Shame about the odd blocking of VJ standing with John and Zac at the back like he's one of the grown-ups rather than the youngest one there.

Nice to have some of Maddy's back story filled in (mostly stuff I thought was evident but people on other threads have questioned it so...).Roo is in a hard place but as it turns out she didn't need to tell Maddy how she feels: She knows already.I'm disappointed that Maddy seems to want to go back but I guess there's a part of her that wants a normal life with her family, even though it's never worked out that way in the past.Disappointed too that Roo wouldn't let her go to see Alf.I'd quite like to meet this Annalise one day.There's a spare room at the caravan park house, surely?

The Leah/Nate stuff was a bit disposable, especially with yet more "The accident was not Nate's fault" stuff.I did like that Ash told Ricky what was going on and that they worked together well, even though it doesn't seem to have done him any good.

[c120701]

It was a bit odd that Marilyn was allowed to go home early, with a residential trip they should surely have had a female adult staying with them given there were female students. 

[atrus]

So is it really a done thing to whisk school parties out into the trenches overnight, make them sleep in the dirt and bombard them with (presumably polystyrene) rubble? Not saying it isn't - I'm just mildly surprised that it would be allowed in this litigious modern era. I'm guessing there would at least be a proper toilet block in close vicinity, although of course that fact may have taken away something of the unique atmosphere of this episode.

Regardless, you'd think that Zac or John might have forewarned Alf, given his life experiences. Maybe they did and we just didn't see that bit? But even so it seemed a bit off to allow a pensioner to bunk down in a trench like that before forcing him to relive his war days. I'm not surprised he keeled over.

Anyhow, it was by far the most watchable the show has been in ages - and it was great to see the kids working together to help Alf, albeit with a probably unfeasible degree of competence. Likewise, Josh putting the blanket over Matt was perhaps not a totally realistic moment given the recent context, but quite a sweet one nonetheless.

Sad for Roo about Maddy's decision to leave. But of course she's right to say that it's not her place to put pressure on her to stay - and her selflessness in that regard made me empathise with her even more.

[Red Ranger 1]

The gold continues to come, and pairing up the oldest and youngest regulars, as with Alf and Jett here, is always a good starting point, especially with Jett showing himself as one of the most mature of the current teens. And throwing in an intriguing and slightly offbeat guest character helps too. Tom is a nice mix of geniality, taking Jett’s variation on the ultimate naïve/insensitive question “Did you kill anyone?” in his stride, and bitterness, and it’s pleasing that, even with the most black and white war of the last century, what sticks in the veteran’s mind is those that didn’t come back. Tom’s stressing the importance of family and bitter reflection on his “luck” leaves me to wonder if maybe he hasn’t got one: That maybe he feels he survived when those who had more to live for didn’t, or that he’s wasted the extra decades they didn’t have.

 

It’s a shame that this is going on at the same time as Maddy’s storyline, meaning Maddy isn’t at Alf’s side like she should be and Roo and especially Alf aren’t involved in Maddy’s dilemma. The idea seemed to be that Alf’s situation caused Maddy to realise how much she cared about him but it didn’t quite gel. Although Oscar’s almost psychic reading of Maddy near the start (“I thought you were going to say something really bad. Are you?”) shows how well they work together, I have mixed feelings about him doing what Roo wouldn’t and pressuring her into stay. It is kind of justified by Maddy already having second thoughts but I wonder how it would have played out if Tanya hadn’t made that dismissive comment about Maddy’s father, showing she still has trouble accepting decisions she doesn’t agree with. (And was that the mask slipping or just her slipping back into old behaviour that she’s trying to change?) But Oscar restates one of the show’s basic credos: That family isn’t just about blood, and sometimes you have to leave your birth family to find your home. And Maddy already is at home with her family. At the risk of straying into areas better suited to the Character Discussion section again, Roo’s “soft” approach to parenting has come in for criticism at times but Maddy attributes her and Alf with her getting her life together so maybe that’s what she needed: Not someone to push her down the “right” path but someone to let her make mistakes (and she’s made plenty) and find her own way. Maddy does seem to be on the right track more than she has been in a long while, hopefully it stays that way. Anyway, it ends realistically (unlike some storylines over the years which have rushed to a reconciliation to give a character a happy ending): Maddy doesn’t have unrealistic expectations of her birth family but she’s back on good terms with them and the door’s open for a return.

 

With all that, the “crime” storyline really can’t hope to grab the interest but if the show is going to do this sort of thing at least they’re doing it right: Kyle and Ash aren’t motivated by a desire for easy money, but by trying to protect someone they care about when they’re backed into a corner and can’t think of any other way, so we sympathise with them. I would query them thinking the money’s too risky at their homes or Angelo’s but leaving it at the gym, a known Braxton business, though. (Are they planning to blame it on Andy if it’s found?!) Surely there’s some remote spots where they could hide it?

[c120701]

You'd think that Roo would have taken Alf some pyjamas into the hospital.