H&Alover Posted January 23, 2018 Report Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, harrietjames said: Didn't Mick knock his pill bottle over and they fell down the sink? Yes, but I think he was looking for more.
Razabaza Posted January 23, 2018 Report Posted January 23, 2018 I found Olivia really unlikable the other day. She was speaking to Hunter in such a snooty tone. I may sound like a jerk, but I feel like Luc's existence has ruined everything. I know it's not her fault but I hate custody/baby storylines. Also, I actually kind of like Mick, he's not somebody I'd trust in real life and he shouldn't get custody, but I find myself sympathizing a small bit with him. He's somehow endearing. Also, does anybody think Raffy looks like a young Anna Kournikova?
Red Ranger 1 Posted January 23, 2018 Report Posted January 23, 2018 8 hours ago, English Invader said: The funny thing is that I feel like I'm actually starting to root for Mick because I'm sick to death of the Luc Fellowship and the self-important attitudes of everyone in it. I lost all sympathy for them when Alf and Irene white handed Mick on the job and the reference. Genuine people with a genuine cause don't resort to sabotage. I also suspect that Ash broke in to Mick's motel room and stole his medication to show him up because of the comment Ash made just before we see Mick desperately looking for his medication (can't remember exactly what it was but it seemed like Ash knew that something was going to happen). 4 hours ago, H&Alover said: Yes, but I think he was looking for more. No-one stole Mick's medication, he knocked the pills down the sink in a temper and then couldn't find the prescription to get more.Which just underlines why he shouldn't be out there: As VJ said, he's just one pill away from becoming a monster.And he's pretty unpleasant even when he takes them.As for sabotage, if you're fighting a system so screwed up that it lets an unrepentant rapist out on the streets, allows him to move in unsupervised near his victims, gives him rights based on a DNA test conducted with an illicit sample taken from a child he's legally supposed to stay away from and even considers giving him custody of the product of his rape, then that's the least you're entitled to do in my opinions.I definitely don't think Irene's obliged to give him a reference, especially when any reference she could give would have any sane landlord running a mile. ("Well, yes, I suppose I did live with him but only because he kidnapped me and kept me tied up in a shack for about two months.") While I certainly don't agree with the idea that a child can only be brought up properly by two parents, I do think Ash has screwed up Luc's life badly.She had a family and he took it away from her.If Luc was still with VJ where she belongs, Mick wouldn't stand a chance.Instead, Mick's just got to prove he's better than a convicted criminal with an unstable romantic life who completely failed to provide the family unit for Luc he promised and is instead having to rely on the people he claimed weren't fit to look after Luc to look after Luc.The arrangement they've got now is what they should have had all along, but because Ash wanted to be the one calling the shots, he undermined their position.And he still doesn't seem to realise that was his mistake, trying to be Luc's father when she's already got one, and neither does anyone else.Alf is still annoying me with comments like "Luc belongs with Ash" which was just about the stupidest thing he could say: Not only is it like a red rag to Mick but it's not even true.I'll give this for Ash, at least he's being open now and making sure everyone's on board with his plan.But what choice do they have?Luc being with Billie's brother is infinitely preferable to being with her rapist. I was seriously annoyed at the way Kat was giggling through Justin's statement like a schoolgirl.Did she not grasp that a fairly serious crime had been committed?Maybe it's understandable that Justin chose to track down the site of the photos himself rather than letting the police handle it, although it frustrated me all the same.I guess I can't blame him that much for stepping in when he saw Willow threatened and at least he had the sense to get out of there quick sharp, although I can't shake the feeling that he'll be back on her doorstep offering to help out before too long.
Slade Posted January 24, 2018 Report Posted January 24, 2018 20 hours ago, English Invader said: The funny thing is that I feel like I'm actually starting to root for Mick because I'm sick to death of the Luc Fellowship and the self-important attitudes of everyone in it. I lost all sympathy for them when Alf and Irene white handed Mick on the job and the reference. Genuine people with a genuine cause don't resort to sabotage. Yep that's how I feel partly. Although I've found people getting annoyed with him (Ash/Alf) quite funny on the whole I've found it annoying how everybody's ganged up on him. I really don't care about the women he's attacked. And I've been quite disappointed with Irene's attitude towards him. He made a very valid point when she went to see him and he said she didn't care that Ash attacked, kidnapped and left him in the bush. 20 hours ago, English Invader said: I guess the best thing for Luc at this stage would be either a care home or a placement in an adoptive/foster family a million miles away from the Fellowship dynamic. She needs a stable home and a stable environment and that's not something that can be achieved by committee. I would be quite happy if none of them ended up with Luc. Although I feel sorry for Mick and as I just mentioned part of me wants him to win just to spite the others, objectively he shouldn't be looking after her. It's just too much of a risk. He is always going to have this problem and as I mentioned in my previous post we've seen how easy it is for him to relapse. 14 hours ago, Razabaza said: I may sound like a jerk, but I feel like Luc's existence has ruined everything. I know it's not her fault but I hate custody/baby storylines. Also, I actually kind of like Mick, he's not somebody I'd trust in real life and he shouldn't get custody, but I find myself sympathizing a small bit with him. He's somehow endearing. Nope I agree. I honestly wish she had never been conceived. Whilst not her fault she has indirectly caused nothing but problems. Good to see support for Mick in this thread! One good thing about the incident with Mick and Ziggy was how it wound Ben up. It's quite amusing watching him suppress his natural urge to kick somebody's head in. Note to anybody that wants to rub him up the wrong way - Now is the time because there's not a damn thing he can do about it. Maggie annoyed me the way she spoke to Mick. He should have told her to get stuffed. I wasn't particularly happy about Justin trying to help Willow. I really don't think she's worth it and just find her highly annoying. I was quite happy for her to be left to her fate. She made her bed. She can go lie in it!
H&Alover Posted January 24, 2018 Report Posted January 24, 2018 4 hours ago, Slade said: I really don't care about the women he's attacked. Never mind that H&A is fiction that is an awful thing to say, would you be saying that if it had been a female relative/friend of yours! None of his other alleged victims have ever come forwards, as far as we know so the only one we know about was Billie who didn't press charges, so sorry to be pedantic Red, Mick is an alleged rapist. If Mick can be that scared about how dangerous he could be after missing just one/two doses, his meds need adjusting. The trailer certainly did mislead us, it was Mick who came off worse when Ziggy whacked him, apart from grabbing her arm, he didn't touch her. He's not your one dimensional bad guy, I have felt sympathy for him at times, but he doesn't do himself any favours most of the time by his attitude which would rub the people around him up the wrong way. He's walking a tightrope most of the time and just the slightest wobble tips him off. When Mick rang the potential landlord he sounded quite normal, whatever that means, and it wasn't how he came across that made the person on the other end put the phone down, it was when he said it's for me and my daughter. I don't think he was ever shown how to interact with people so has no idea to behave. Sadly, it's his reputation, alleged rape, kidnapping that angered Ben (and Maggie), Ziggy, though, did stand up for him and stated officially he didn't hurt her, just scared her. We all know Mick has an AVO but perhaps Irene and rest of the gang should have one, seeing as they keep approaching him! But having said all that in his favour, I don't think he is anywhere near stable enough to look after her, especially not alone. Ash, as we all know is no saint, but he can and does admit when he has screwed up. He was beating himself up about "if only I'd applied for custody earlier", but it could equally be argued if only VJ & Billie had registered Luc's birth earlier or if only they had been properly married, a lot of if only's, you'd drive yourself mad thinking that. Ash got care of Luc because VJ was having serious doubts and was having trouble looking after her, despite Leah's help, he was seriously scared he'd hurt her and he felt, at the time, she'd be better with Ash who was older so more able to cope which he was and he has done a good job with Irene and on and off Kat to help. After VJ Billie would want Ash to look after Luc, Mick wouldn't even make it onto her list. OK Ash has got everyone on his side on leaving the country, BUT, as he is a convicted crim would he be able to, Kyle wasn't able to join Phoebe on her tour because of his conviction and how long that does rule apply for anyway? Seems Tori is going to go with him. Ash is scared he could go to prison because of his kidnapping and dumping of Mick, another thing in his favour, strangely enough, it has taken him until now to make an official complaint, but their solicitor still hasn't done her spade work by talking to Mick's doctors at the secure facility and getting their professional opinion, though as we know it's not to be entirely trusted. Maggie was doing what any mother would have known irrespective of who was on the receiving end, warning someone who could hurt her daughter off. Ben, also, acted as any father would if they are caring dads of course. It was totally unprofessional of Kat laughing about Buddy's dognap, never mind Buddy isn't a human, it's still a crime, but he did have to tell Brody and Tori about it. Now about Justin doing his own tracking down of Willow's whereabouts, wasn't it just the day before Ash told him he (Justin) couldn't drive because of his leg, yet there he was driving! Confused dotcom (again). Of course he'll be back, wonder if it is something to do with her nan that has got Willow involved with Lloyd and his mate. Lloyd was very concerned, to put it lightly, about his $15,000, but no mention of the gun, nothing to do with him maybe? I did have to smile when Justin was talking to Buddy about him (Buddy) being a sucker for a pretty face wonder where he gets that from?
Razabaza Posted January 24, 2018 Report Posted January 24, 2018 10 hours ago, Slade said: I would be quite happy if none of them ended up with Luc. Although I feel sorry for Mick and as I just mentioned part of me wants him to win just to spite the others, objectively he shouldn't be looking after her. It's just too much of a risk. He is always going to have this problem and as I mentioned in my previous post we've seen how easy it is for him to relapse. Yet again, I feel a bit sorry for Mick. He's mentally ill and people are so cruel and snooty towards him. I'm not excusing his crimes, but he just looked so frail and frightened when he ran out of his medication. Obviously, in real life, I wouldn't want somebody like Mick to win custody of a defenseless child, but this is fiction, and I can't stand the holier than thou attitudes of Ash and pals. I don't like this new woman Willow. She has such a bad attitude. I'd be so angry if somebody stole my dog. It's such a cruel and pointless thing to do. Also, why was Justin the only one who seemed to care about Buddy being kidnapped? Tori didn't seem bothered at all.
Red Ranger 1 Posted January 24, 2018 Report Posted January 24, 2018 At the risk of writing an essay, I can actually kind of understand people sympathising with Mick.It seems like another case of the show making a character completely irredeemable and then trying to backtrack and make them out to be sympathetic.Except it feels like not everyone on the show is on board, so how sympathetic he is varies massively and then they dub creepy music over his scenes anyway.After what he's done, no-one in Summer Bay will ever accept him, nor should they.I'm afraid I'm fully on board with him being treated like the pariah he should be.Given that he's lucky to have been allowed out when by rights he should still be locked up, he should have the decency to go somewhere else and start again but it's that self-entitled attitude again: He thinks he's entitled to Irene's help and he thinks he's entitled to have Luc with him when he's done nothing to deserve either.(I would seriously love to see a custody hearing where he's asked to explain how he came to be the biological father.)As for Luc...I don't object to her existence and am actually quite fond of her, but I think the show has chosen the wrong approach at every turn since she was born.This could have been a heartwarming storyline but instead they've killed the heart and gone for the melodrama at almost every opportunity from the senseless death of Billie to the distasteful custody battle and now the return of Mick, a character that I think absolutely no-one on screen or off actually wanted back.VJ didn't lose custody because he was afraid he couldn't cope: He lost her because Luc had an undiagnosed condition which people with their own agenda unknowingly used to paint him as a bad father because he couldn't settle her.And by the time the truth came out, Mick had already reared his ugly head and VJ had to go along with Ash playing parent to his daughter so they could show a united front. If only Ash had trusted VJ to look after her in the first place.(As an aside, it's slightly frustrating that everyone's treating Ash and Mick as the only options with a throwaway comment about "The court's already ruled against us.") Talking of which, I really can't take Tori wanting to throw everything away to be with Ash seriously.They've been together five minutes and they've already had one major falling out.It feels like she's blinded by the first flush of love/lust and being irrational. Anyway, the Glow Day was actually quite good and it's always nice to see the community pulling together and showing what they're really all about.I actually quite liked Ryder in that opening scene with Coco and Raffy, where he seemed to have got over his habit of cracking onto them and they just seemed to be having fun.Then he snapped back to being a jerk to the point that, coupled with his tumble while sleepwalking at the end (Alf disturbing him was probably not a good idea), suggests there might actually be something wrong with him medically: Maybe ADHD or some sort of sleeping disorder? Ironic that the first time we see Coco actually being a good empathetic friend to someone and it's Jennifer, not that the latter's so keen to accept it, and an interesting reminder of her own claim to have an eating disorder.Ben attempting to keep Brody and Ziggy apart only to end up becoming friends with him himself was a nice moment.Nice too that the Mason/Ziggy friendship hasn't been totally forgotten.Diana has been less annoying lately but still seems to think the world should revolve around her so hard to feel sorry for her overhearing Ben and Maggie.
Slade Posted January 25, 2018 Report Posted January 25, 2018 19 hours ago, H&Alover said: Never mind that H&A is fiction that is an awful thing to say, would you be saying that if it had been a female relative/friend of yours! What do you mean never mind H & A is fiction? That's exactly why people make comments about characters that they wouldn't make about an actual person. For the umpteenth time I have to say this: Home and Away IS fictional. It's not real life so it shouldn't matter what I say towards a fictional character because it's not necessarily relevant in how I would act towards a real person. I'll use the same argument I used last time but I've wished characters dead in soaps/programs/films before and have cheered when they've been murdered e.g. Trystan when Charlotte ran him over. So do you think that's awful as well? Are you going to start calling every poster out or only when they say something unsympathetic regarding a sexual crime? And let's just say for arguments sake that I did make that comment about real people, bad stuff happens around the world all the time. Am I supposed to care about every single bad thing that happens to every single person. Whilst not all people I believe that a lot of people will only care about friends, immediate family or someone that they know or can associate with at some level. In answer to your question yes I would care if it was a friend or family member and even if something like this did happen to someone I didn't care about it I probably wouldn't publicly announce it. To me it seemed as though Ryder was still trying to charm both Coco and Raffy just not as aggressively as he was before. He was out of order the way he spoke to Coco when she went to find him the next day to help them with the glow day. I do think it was very brave of her to stand up like that and speak in front of everyone and tell them about her eating disorder. Jen initially reminded me that for the most part she continued to show very few redeeming qualities (the only thing I really like about her previously is the fact that her dad stuffed up Ben and Maggie's original plans for the peer) but there did seem to be a glimmer of hope even though I remain suspicious of her. Hmmm, so Coco knows that something is up with Jen rather than her just believing that Jen was familiar with her symptoms and figured out she had an eating disorder. OK so Ben wasn't too bad and I did find it slightly amusing his attempts to stop Ziggy from spending time with Brody by outbidding her. Very surprised he and Maggie are cool with Ziggy and Brody spending time together as friends. Come on. When people say "as friends" it's often almost a way of saying it's a date but someone might object so they won't explicitly say that and go out of there way to make it clear it's platonic. Even if it isn't, if they start to spend a lot of time together it will only lead to one thing. A reminder that Tori once again is like an adolescent when it comes to relationships. Whilst not as bad as Kyle Braxton here we have another case of someone that is prepared to throw everything away for someone they've been dating for a very short period of time. She's worked damn hard as a doctor and been promoted to a registrar. She's going to give up a very good career and her family for Ash. Given her tendency to be fickle i.e. Nate/Duncan/Riley etc. I think this is a very bad move.
H&Alover Posted January 25, 2018 Report Posted January 25, 2018 It was the way you said you didn't care, you repeated what I said about H&A being fictional I KNOW! Was it because we didn't 'know' Mick's other alleged victims, so it's OK to say we shouldn't care what happened to them. Would it have made a difference if we had? We didn't know any of the Yorkshire Ripper's victims, but we could still care about what happened to them. They were innocent, a lot of characters in soaps/dramas have been and a lot haven't been and have been bumped off. I'm entitled to my opinion just as you are entitled to yours but we can still disagree with what each of us say. That's what forums are for after all. It may be more of a case of to some degree while sympathising with Mick we don't sympathise with the things he's done. It was only by chance he discovered he was Luc's dad by being brought to the hospital after getting hit by Irene and seeing Billie there and seeing she was pregnant and doing his sums. If that 'meeting' hadn't occurred we wouldn't be in the situation we are now. I think I read on another post somewhere that Mick could argue in court the sex he had with Billie was consensual, an one night stand, she isn't here to dispute the fact and VJ and Ash's testimony against that would be hearsay. As a complete aside wasn't he identified by a tattoo on his arm, Billie remembered it, have we seen it lately? It took Tori to finally realise what was wrong with Luc and her constant crying, VJ did snap at her a few times, threw a mug at her cot and shook it, Ash & Kat had problems with that and they are adults. Although I don't think Mick would intentionally hurt Luc I wonder how he would have coped with the constant crying? Ash, VJ and co do have a rather defeatist attitude towards what the court would say. Even if they did jail Ash for his assault, he could get a suspended, no guarantee Mick would automatically get custody. I didn't catch where it was Ash, Tori and Luc were off to, I did hear it was where Luc had relatives. No mention again of how Ash is going to leave the country? We do have a few days before they leave and a few days is a long time in soapland! Justin is being quite patronising with Tori, she does have her own mind, Ash didn't ask her to go with him, she chose to. Did the time line get screwed again, Justin accosts Ash outside the Diner, having a rant about Tori being 'dragged off' by him, first he'd heard obviously, he returns to the Morgan house and asks Tori about it. Once she has persuaded him she is serious, he said he'd square it with Justin? I don't think there is a time limit on how long you have known someone to know they are the one you are willing to give everything up for. Tori wasn't that prepared to give it all up for Nate, more into having a long distance relationship, didn't happen with Duncan either, but there was the small matter of his wife still being in the picture. But we are talking Tori, except this time there is a baby involved so not just an adults feelings to be messed about with. On a lighter note the Glow day did go very well, I was surprised to see Ryder there helping out and no sign of flirting with either Coco or Raffy, just three young people having a laugh. Coco was stressing because she didn't want to appear a failure, quite needlessly as it tuned out. Ryder looked completely out of it when Coco tried to rouse him the next morning and although his snapping at her wasn't right, we may have found out the reason why later that night. Alf may have been in error shocking him like that, looked like he was sleepwalking, explains his always being found asleep on the sofa and mood swings and I thought the same some undiagnosed medical problem there. He was back to his usual bouncy self at the Fund Raiser. After not seeing her for a while Jen made an appearance and in his true flirty mood picked up by Ryder. After telling only a few people, family and Raffy very courageous of Coco to announce in public she had bulimia. Laughed at Ben outbidding Ziggy for Brody to be their partner, their play fighting, Gladiator style, seemed to have resolved their differences and although they will probably never be BFF's a truce has been made. Diana was still in her up herself manner, moaning about her meal being too salty, having to take part in what seemed to me to be beneath her even though it was to support her granddaughter. Maggie had no such problem showing the difference between them, she did looked shocked to overhear Maggie agreeing with Ben she needed to be told to go. So onto Jennifer, she had to make that making herself sick gesture, but later after she was made to look silly when Ryder tripped her up, she did at least agree Coco's Fund raising was good, and Coco, when she could have snubbed her or jeered back, didn't but offered an olive branch and the chance to open up about her own problems. She may have brushed that offer aside for now, but that could change.
Razabaza Posted January 25, 2018 Report Posted January 25, 2018 How is leaving the country with Luc going to fix things? Surely Mick would just track them down. Besides, wouldn't Ash and Tori be charged with Kidnap?
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