2018 Season - UK Episode Discussion

[Red Ranger 1]

A deeply deeply frustrating episode.

We almost did it.We almost got Raffy out of that oubliette and that cult that have taken her, but no.I will never accept that that's her home, she does not belong there and John and Marilyn are not her family.No matter how many times the show tries to insist otherwise.John and Marilyn didn't give a damn about her being happy, they just cared about keeping her.They might have claimed otherwise, but that ambush at breakfast and that act in the Diner were obviously designed to further brainwash her into doing what they want.The Morgans should never have let them get their hands on her, but it's too late now and she's completely under their thrall.If she'd gone to them like she did to Justin, saying she'd had a falling out at her old home and wanted to stay with them, they'd have bitten her hands off.John, Marilyn and the people running the show seem to have no idea what fostering is about: It is NOT about ripping a vulnerable girl out of a loving family and convincing her she belongs with you.Marilyn's been trying to steal other people's children for years and she's finally managed it.The whole thing is completely wrong and is threatening to ruin what should be a good storyline, making John and Marilyn and even Ty unsympathetic at the very moment we need to be rooting for them to stay together, to the point that I actually wanted Social Services to take Ty away rather than doing what the plot demands.Because they handled the situation appallingly.I understand John and Marilyn not wanting to out Ty, but it should have come from him and they should have made him feel comfortable enough to be honest, not sent him away while they tried to palm Catherine off with platitudes.Nice soundbites about "no apologies or explanations" aside...maybe I'm being a bit black and white, but despite the episode trying to claim the opposite, Ty didn't feel comfortable enough to be himself with the social worker and if he's not in an environment where he feels able to be himself and say what he is without fear of judgement, then John and Marilyn are failing him.Ryder had the maturity to know when they were at the point where the truth was needed and privacy took second place to safety, they don't.Ryder even says that Ty should tell Catherine the truth here, but his advice gets handwaved away.

And then we're on to Willow and Dean.Are we meant to be on their side and hope their "victimless crime" works?I mean, I can't bring myself to hate on them too much and say that they're irredeemable, because we've got to know them before this and know that there's more to them than stealing, but it does sum up where the show's gone wrong.When they injure Alf while committing a robbery and run off leaving him lying unconscious at the end, my immediate thought was "Karen and Revhead." But while Revhead was portrayed as a nasty piece of work who was going to get his, I suspect nothing much will happen to Dean or Willow at all, except maybe some backstreet justice courtesy of Mr Brett.

And three episodes after their "closure", Hunter and Olivia are back flirting.I'm with Irene here: "Blah blah blah." We've heard similar speeches many times and this one rang even less true than most.They had a "moment" so they...had sex and turned it into a big drama.The "new improved" Hunter and Olivia do not live here.

[Slade]

On 31/07/2018 at 14:20, H&Alover said:

Ziggy knew what she was doing marrying Brody

 

On 31/07/2018 at 14:20, H&Alover said:

Not as if she forced him down the aisle  - or in their case - footpath.

The first and last parts of the response quoted above are pretty much stating that Brody and Ziggy knowingly want to get married which is clear from watching the episodes.  I'm not questioning the fact they want to get married or whether they are willing participants.  I'm questioning the validity of their reasons for getting married.  Marriage is a lifelong commitment.  Ziggy's last boyfriend cheated on her and she felt very strongly about that (So much so that she was prepared to ruin her friendship with Olivia to tell Hunter about her and Axel).  You would have thought that she would want to take things slowly i.e. go out with Brody for a while to determine that he's trustworthy in the fidelity department before deciding on a future.  Even when the subject of kids came up Ziggy freaked out.  So she wasn't ready for commitment.  Ziggy and Brody have been dating for less than 6 months.  It's ridiculous they are getting married now after going out for such a short period of time given the issues Brody has had.

 

On 31/07/2018 at 14:20, H&Alover said:

she knows he's an addict and he always will be, doesn't matter when he marries.

Yes it does.  When they were getting closer just as he was out of rehab, even Irene expressed extreme reservations about them getting back together and rightly so.  The golden rule with addicts is not to get involved with someone romantically during the recovery phase because a relationship introduces another dependency.  Whilst you can argue that Brody has been clean for a while, I still don't think it's long enough to get married.  And he really hasn't been fully tested and by that I mean things haven't really been too bad for him.  Normally if he somehow gets into a situation where he's at an all time low then we will see how well he copes and whether the temptation to return to drugs arises.  The last time Brody's actions lead to Zannis kidnapping Ziggy.  Even though I hated Ben at the time, his attitude about Brody and Ziggy getting together was very understandable.  And I actually found his turnaround hard to believe - He accepted Brody just because he didn't want Ziggy to get back with Jarrod?!

 

 

On 31/07/2018 at 14:20, H&Alover said:

They would have eventually married

How do you know they would have eventually married?  Back to my previous point above.  Life hasn't been too bad for Brody and his relationship with Ziggy really hasn't been tested yet.  Most people would have reservations about marrying a drug addict.  IMO Brody's main reason for marrying Ziggy is because he wants to keep her happy, doesn't want to lose her and was pressured by Ben.  Ziggy's main reason for marrying Brody is because she doesn't want her mother to die without seeing her get married.  If Maggie had gone into remission a couple of months ago this wouldn't have been a consideration.

 

I feel Raffy has been hard done-by.  She always seems to give more to other people than what she gets back.  I've mentioned before that I don't think Coco is a very good friend to her.  She's shown her very little support during their time together even though Raffy has been there for her more often than not.  We had her own family treating her like a little kid i.e. deliberately keeping things, still treating her like an outsider even though she's shown how much she loves them, despite not knowing them for very long.  We have John and Marilyn manipulating her into living with them.  We have Ty going out with her even though he's gay and despite her being quite attentive towards him.  I accept the confused argument but that doesn't really help Raffy, especially considering he was her first boyfriend.  Then we have one of her closet friends keeping this from her.  I'm actually quite glad she's been lashing out at people.  She's fully entitled to and unfortunately that includes Ty.  Raffy was obviously falling for him pretty quickly and I think she was right speaking her mind.  The only person who I think doesn't deserve it is Ryder as he was in a pretty impossible position.  I was not happy with the outcome of yesterday's episode.  After watching the preview last week, I was looking forward to Raffy moving and John and Marilyn being out of shape but they manipulate her once more and emotionally blackmail her into staying.  I don't think Raffy and Ty should be living under the same roof at least until she's over him.  Similarly if Ty has strong feelings for Ryder I don't think he should be spending much time with him either.

 

Irene's reaction upon seeing Hunter and Olivia interact with each other was really funny.  It's like she immediately and instinctively knew exactly what was going on.  The way she was when they were having dinner showed she is just as cynical as most regarding them.

[D.B]

For Tuesday, I'm glad that Coco was able to get to Ziggy, she would want to know and also happy that Maggie has decided to continue the treatment. I also loved the banter between Ryder and Ty, Ryder continuing to be a good friend to Ty even after all the awkwardness. It's good to see that Ty's feelings towards Ryder was still adressed. I feel like John and Marilyn did try their best with Ty, they do want to support him. 

Now for Wednesday, and I agree completely with you Red, a very frustrating episode.

I feel conflicted about the Palmer household situation. While I do believe John and Marilyn do want what's best for Raffy and Ty, I feel like they're deluding themselves into thinking that Raffy staying with them is the absolute best idea above all else, when it is 100% is not. They completely manipulated the situation for Raffy into making sure that she'll stay with them, and the way they acted around Ty, well I can't blame Catherine for being suspicious. I don't doubt that they want what's best for Ty,but they're handling it all wrong. I felt like Ty was feeling like he was being pressured by both sides, which isn't right, and it's not making me like John and Marilyn very much, which is, completely, a shame. The only person that seems to be handling this right is Ryder, as always. The thing that annoyed me the most is that Raffy calling the house her home. It's not! John and Marilyn do want to take care of her, I do not doubt that, but it's not thier place to take her form her actual family to suit themselves. The only other highlight besides from Ryder is the Ty and Raffy conversation at the end, both were truthful to each other, and they seem to be reaching an understanding.

And now to Dean and Willow. I don't know what reality Dean thinks he lives in, credit-card skimming is stealing and just because the victims may get their money back doesn't make it less of stealing. And Willow is unbelievable agreeing to go along with it instead of the many other more reasonable and better ways they could get money, like I don't know, look for another job in a different place? And just when I thought they couldn't get even low than stealing from people they know, they have done the unforgivable: they attacked Alf and left him there injured. Are we suppose to sympathise with them? Are we suppose to hope that they'll succeed in the end? I never really liked Dean, but I before this was warming up to him, and I expected much more from Willow than this, but leaving Alf helpless on the floor like that? They're cowards. Like Red, I won't say I absolutely hate them, but there is a strong dislike for them from me (too much that I doubt that I'll ever really like them again) and I hope they'll get in trouble for this, but since people have gotten away on the show with much worse, like Hunter, the Braxtons, Tank, etc, I don't think that'll happen. Shame. Shame on the two of them. 

The only highlights were Irene being herself with Hunter and Olivia and that Justin knows about Hazel so now he's has a bigger chance to see Ava again. 

[H&Alover]

To repeat my response Brody is and always will be an addict, he can fall off the wagon anytime, anything could trigger it, at the moment he's got very good reasons not to slip.  Look at Irene, sober for years, then memories of what happened to her as a girl toppled her off her particular wagon having been through other upsets.

Raffy has to and froed between the Morgan's and John & Maz's for ages now.  Justin's comment that she couldn't keep running away from her problems by changing homes was out of order, it was them who decided she should move out because of the various dangers they have been in, first with The Syndicate, then Brody's druggie 'mates', then kept away because of Robbo hiding out in the garage.  She felt settled at John & Marilyn's. Btw I didn't think they were fostering Raffy, just looking after her?  Thank God for small mercies Raffy didn't blurt out Ty's secret while Christine was standing behind her. Fair game to Marilyn & John they didn't reveal,  under Christine's interrogation, what was really going on with Ty, it isn't their secret to tell, although that didn't stop Raffy telling Justin,  it was actually Ty telling Christine that being with John & Marilyn is the first time he's felt really safe for a long time that swung it.  That in itself was telling, at least to me, had he not felt safe with his granddad?  John was getting himself into knots by spouting verbatim the words from the website but thankfully gave up and admitted to Ty he didn't have the right words, but that he & Marilyn would always be there for him, boosted his confidence enough anyway for Ty to feel able to face going to the Diner with Ryder.  Ty voiced what I mentioned a while back, about being worried about going back to school and what will happen if/when the news breaks.  Kids, well some, can be very cruel to anyone who they see as in anyway different.  Teachers can only be there some of the time to keep an eye on things.  Hopefully Raffy will have worked her way through her feelings by then so won't 'out' Ty in  a fit of temper or if any remarks are made about her and Ty dating. At least her & Ty have started talking, well he's been trying to for the last week but she kept shutting him down, so maybe they can get to some middle ground.

Atrus - that was a  typical Ryder answer to Ty's remark about he was mostly over him.  Teenage boys don't need to over analyse things which 'grown-ups' feel the need to. They've talked it through, resolved it to their satisfaction, that's it. If there is any trouble at school, Ryder will be there for his mate.

If Ziggy hadn't been told and they'd let her enjoy her honeymoon wouldn't that be the same as Maggie, Ben & Ziggy not telling Coco about Maggie stopping her treatment? She deserved to know and it was her decision to come back.  Coco was a lot less brattier and gave a lot better argument, if that is the word,  for why Maggie should start it again but I do feel she was railroaded into continuing her treatment.  It is good that are all there for her, Brody keeping a discreet distance, supportive but not pushing in but just being there for them all. So, sorry for starting a sentence with that word, despite Maggie saying she didn't want Diana to know, Ben has rung her.  Maggie said it was because she didn't think Diana would be able to cope, let's see shall we, Maggie is her daughter and  is made of pretty strong stuff she must have got it from somewhere.

As for Anna Cocquerel who plays Coco not looking 16 people can look younger or older than their actual age, only a year in her case.  Lukas Radovitch who plays Ryder is lucky he can look young enough at 23 to play a 17 year old.  People in their 20's can get asked for ID in pubs, I know I did, I thought it was great, made my day.  Guess Coco has one of those flexible birthdays, it'll either be suddenly remembered or it'll be mentioned as an aside she had it on such and such a date.

As a complete aside will Ziggy and Brody be staying at the farmhouse for the forseeable?

On to Dean & Willow and Brett putting the squeeze on Dean to pay the money back tomorrow, what made Dean think another week would made any difference?  Card skimming  may be a non violent crime and the victims will get their money back, but it will still be putting some in the same position Dean & Willow are now, skint, owing rent, utility bills.  Of course it had to be Irene who they saw using the machine just after Willow had done her trickery on it.  Does Alf have a sign around his neck saying 'please knock me out'?  To be serious didn't actually see who knocked him over but he's already sus about Willow & Dean having seen them come down from Colby & Robbo's place. May be wrong of them 'squatting' there but at least the place isn't empty.

I know Irene has her doubts but I think Hunter & Olivia were genuine, they are over each other. 

From what we saw Colby does appear to be coming round, hopefully with no lasting ill effects, ie brain damage so he can tell McCarthy who it was whacked him on the head with the frying pan and drugged him with the muscle relaxant while telling him why!  Also saw Robbo asking Justin for help.

[Razabaza]

I think the actress who plays Coco looks like an actual teenager in the show, but in Instagram pictures she looks older, like mid 20s. Don't know why because she is really a teen, maybe some people just look older in pictures than in motion?

[Red Ranger 1]

Willow earns a couple of points by ringing an ambulance for Alf, which is more than some people would have done, including Dean.I thought of selling the Triumph quite a while before she actually did it, which seems like the ideal solution to the hole they've dug.But did she really think that throwing the skimmer in the bin was enough to stop Dean? Because he's really not that trustworthy.She should have smashed it: As it is, I'm assuming he has access to the accounts of everyone who paid by card at Salt, including Irene."Whoops" doesn't even begin to cover it.And after being curiously uncredited yesterday, here we find Dean's now a regular, just in case we were worried he might get his comeuppance.I noticed someone's removed the crime scene tape from the flat.Presumably the police did it and didn't check if anyone had broken in...

It feels a bit like someone shot two alternatives and used them both: Yesterday, Justin indicated he knew about Hazel, today he finds out for a second time.(Or maybe he just hadn't told Tori or learned the new information.)Once again, Robbo gets kept in a holding cell for a week instead of being sent to remand, which is where you'd expect him to be even if they were waiting on a bail hearing.McCarthy veers between being unnecessarily blinkered (Ebony being Boyd's sister might not be a crime, but it is a motive, which is more than Robbo seems to have) and unnecessarily lenient (letting an alleged murderer who's no longer a serving police officer look at case files and allowing anyone who turns up unmonitored access to him).This seems like a good time to ask...has Robbo got any money coming in? I know he got given access to his accounts with months of untouched pay when he found out his identity, but I'm guessing the feds have stopped paying him by now, so is he just living off his savings?

Further on odd timing: Hunter and Mason's conversation implies it's the day after the wedding, when it's at least three days later.

[H&Alover]

Willow did redeem herself somewhat by ringing for an ambulance but Dean was right they can track the call and identify it was a female caller. She was hardly subtle when she was asking Hunter & Olivia about Alf the next day. I was half expecting the police to suspect Hunter & Mason being the ones responsible for knocking Alf out seeing as they were standing over his body when the ambulance crew turned up.  But then it could be argued Dean redeemed himself by turning up at the hospital to check on Colby when it seemed he'd been visiting him a lot anyway. Didn't Willow sell the Triumph a while back & Justin bought it back for her?  Now don't be naïve Red, re the skimmer, it's like women chucking away pregnancy test kits in the rubbish bin for anyone to find.

Alf, luckily, made a good recovery though not really down to Mason & Hunter who just kept him company, made sure he was comfortable until the ambulance turned up a few minutes later.   He's a stubborn old coot and wouldn't be told to rest.  I think we should accept by now time can be fluid in the bay.

That was a complete U-turn by McCarthy going from refusing to even listen to Robbo's explanation to letting him see the crime scene photos - none of which could have happened if he'd been sent to remand  - and seeming to believe his reasoning, he even came across as actually worried when he was updating Robbo on Colby's condition.  The only reason I could think of Lance being unavailable is because he's on an undercover job, but wouldn't Robbo still have that info about Ebony on his phone?  True it isn't a crime to be related to a criminal but it does raise doubts about her character and her motives.  Robbo did raise another reason why  that phial in his place had his prints on it, Ebony planted them and he's a pro so no way would he have left it in his own rubbish bin, he'd have dumped it in a communal one.  He did admit he was fooled by Ebony. Funny you should mention McCarthy letting Robbo see anyone who happened to turn up, because this time round Tori was very conspicuous by her absence.  I know she has been busy looking after Colby but he is Robbo's roommate, friend even and she had to have known he was banged up under suspicion of putting him in hospital but this time no rushing down to check he's OK every other day. 

Robbo is hardly a big spender so apart from food and other necessities  he should still have a good amount of money in his account.

The realisation has been made that an ampoule of the muscle relaxant has gone missing so they finally get round to checking the CCTV, though Ebony being Ebony doesn't look at the camera to help the investigation.  But with all the techniques they have now they could use face recognition to narrow it down.

When we first saw Justin & Tori talking it was about him getting access to Ava and he and Nina having mediation, then he appeared to get the news about Ebony, you're right Red he did hear about Hazel being dead, only mentioned it in passing though, hence the access call. It may seem logical, if that is the right word,  to him but why would Ebony want to kidnap Ava, that was all down to Hazel wanting to get back the money Justin 'cheated' her out of and didn't Ebony get it back with the out of court settlement?    She did seem to drop Tori from her list of people to be paid to 'suffer', she used Willow & Dean to get to Colby.

Colby finally came round, only to be put back on the ventilator when he couldn't breathe.  They may have never become an actual couple but I liked Jasmine's reasoning for her being there when he woke up, she remembered how scary it was when she came round with no friendly face around.

Maggie didn't look that pleased to see her mum and I reckon Ben wished he hadn't rung her when she made her suggestion about whisking Maggie overseas for treatment!  

Am I being cynical in not being sure about this new 'job' Olivia has been asked to do?

[Red Ranger 1]

Alf's episode count this week:Four.

I'm surprised it took everyone that long to notice there were ampoules missing: I was expecting Tori and Jasmine to do it last week when they checked how much medication Colby had been given.So, we do get a bit more information on why Ebony killed Hazel with the revelation of her abuse, although the sadistic way she tried to kill Colby makes it hard to sympathise with her.(Ironically, if it wasn't for the allergic reaction, he'd probably be back on his feet by now.)It just about makes sense for them to take the evidence to McCarthy but they'd have been better off going to Robbo's defence at that point.At least it seems Kurt's getting some more work out of it.The teaming of Mason and Jasmine stoked my disappointment that they were never a thing.

Well, Diana showed up and quickly showed why no-one rang her before, especially since it inspired Coco to go back into brat mode.I'm surprised Maggie is so quick to agree to the trials: It's hard to see them being any sort of help if she's unlikely to survive the trip.

[CaptainHulk]

Did anyone else hear Saxamophone when Suxamethonium was mentioned?! 

*Homer impression* "Saxamaphone.... Saxamaphone!"

(I'm here all week!)

Anyway, I can just visualize Hazel beating seven Kinds out of Ebony with a broom, at times keeping her under the stairs with a bowl of scraps and bucket, not of water but in order for her to make some.... That's just the kind of Woman she probably was!

Robbo has a point about the system, it's had its way with him enough!

The series will get to the point we see Alf all of 90, sat at the Welcome sign in a rocking chair telling folk "Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter!" then cackling! 

And in regard to Red, I had Revhead/Karen flashbacks too only, Dean didn't Kosh Alf!

[atrus]

John and Marilyn were on very dodgy ground on Wednesday with the fostering agency, I felt, and far from covered themselves in glory. I'm not suggesting we take the claim that they forgot to tell them about Ty's accident/running away at anything other than face value - although it could certainly be seen as beneficial to their plans to 'keep the family together' to deliberately conceal that info. But forgetting in itself isn't exactly responsible, and given that they had been rejected for fostering previously, you'd think they'd be doing everything they could to keep things by the book.

Telling the caseworker about Ty being gay is debatable I suppose - there is a legitimate question over whether the agency needs to hold that information. But at the same time, you could see the caseworker's point of view when she walks in on that family scene and then gets completely stonewalled by John and Marilyn when she asks for an explanation. I felt like they could probably have given her a 'ballpark' account of what's gone on, along the lines of: "Ty was coming to terms with something personal and we aren't sure what the rights and wrongs are of talking to you about it without his permission." That would have immediately let her know in roundabout terms what was going on, put the ball in Ty's court without creating the impression that he's being pressured into silence, and also demonstrated a willingness to cooperate. Instead, by just going silent and later being defensive and aggressive, they made it look like they had something to hide; and indeed, they did. Because it's not just about Ty's sexuality - it seems the caseworker hasn't found out about Ty and Raffy being in a relationship either. And it's very convenient for John and Maz, arguably, that that little sidenote is wrapped up in the gay thing and therefore they can justify to themselves the decision to keep it from the caseworker. She certainly wouldn't move Ty out of the house because he had a traumatic coming-out experience, but I'm not sure the same could be said if she knew Ty and Raffy had been in a relationship. In that context, John's quip about having successfully fooled the agency or however he put it seems dreadfully off-colour because: yes, they have. To be fair to Marilyn and John, I do think they genuinely care for Raffy just as they do for Ty - Marilyn was more upset about Raffy feeling she'd broken her trust than that she was considering moving out - but I still think they were wrong in exerting emotional pressure to get her to stay when it's not necessarily currently the best place for her.

So McCarthy had done a complete U-turn on Thursday since the last time we saw him, from being pointlessly obstructive on all counts to confirming Ebony is Boyd's sister, trying to get hold of Lance and even asking the hospital how Colby is - so that's a big improvement. Unfortunately the U-turn was so extreme that he was also content to let a murder suspect sift through the evidence of the case for him. It's almost as if his intransigence the other day was just a dramatic holding device, which then crept back into play again on Friday as he started curtailing Robbo's newfound investigatory freedoms. Not that it mattered, as Tori, Jasmine and Mason seemed far more capable of accruing the necessary evidence than the police were. The revelation of Ebony's motivation for killing Hazel felt a bit glib and convenient, and so I hope we get more about this later on. While no doubt Ebony has a reason to hate Hazel for her treatment as a child, waiting till now to exact revenge just because it suited her to have a dead body to hand doesn't quite ring true for me. So I'm hoping we get some kind of flashback to the day of Hazel's death in which we see that abuse bubbling to the surface again, perhaps, even if only verbally; I could then probably see that being enough of a trigger to prompt Ebony to act in that way.

Mixed feelings about Dean becoming a regular, as he and Willow are fast becoming the latest Hunters in terms of the writers' determination to keep making them do difficult-to-forgive things, the latest being skimming credit cards and then leaving Alf for dead. That said, Dean's been worse than Willow over the last few days - at least she's been feeling guilty about Alf, and then binned the skimmer (albeit, in classic soap style, in the kitchen trash for easy retrieval later).

I did feel bad for Diana initially when she found out she'd been kept in the dark, although she soon went to lengths to remind us why she's not the first person one calls in times of crisis. But, hey, she's apparently fast-tracked Maggie into a bed at a magical hospital somewhere in undefined Europe (a deus ex machina also beloved of Ramsay Street's residents as a venue for the administration of miracle cures), so I'm guessing that will be the cancer storyline wrapped up after a short (and I think much deserved) break for Kestie while Maggie's abroad?

In other news, Hunter and Olivia have 'evolved' - the latest in a long line of euphemisms for 'still spending nearly every scene together'.