Tammin: 'Home & Away' is unrealistic

[claire_louise]

Argh, not this argument again! Noooooo!

[CMS]

I know how you feel, Claire Louise I feel like I've seen this argument a hundred times before as well on various H&A forums...

Reluctant though I am to bring the situation up again, there are a few things I'd like to point out.

The trouble with the word "consent" is that it is difficult to define in rape cases. People don't generally sign forms consenting to the act before having sex, consent is usually assumed when both people carry on and don't make any vocal or physical objections. Kane could not read Dani's mind, and unless she actually forcefully told him no, and he was required to physically restrain her in order to go through with the act, that one cannot really blame him, or accuse him of "rape".

What we saw of the storyline was Dani very obviously flirting with Kane, dressing provocatively, inviting him into the house, and then bringing him up to her bedroom. What happened from there was unseen and had to be figured out based on the erspective character's accounts after the event.

There is a clip from the episode where Kane raped Dani on kaneandkirsty.com. Kane had helped Dani to carry in the shopping. He started to kiss her and she pulled away. He grabbed hold of her again and she immediately started shouting at him and stop it and get away from her, sounding very frightened, before the screen faded to black. She definitely told him 'no' forcefully. They were in the kitchen; she certainly hadn't invited him up to her bedroom. As far as dressing provocatively goes, she was wearing a sleeveless shirt, as pretty much all the characters do.

Personally, I can't see how anybody could think that what Kane did to Dani wasn't rape, or that he could in conscience assume that she consented. I know there are many cases where both parties are genuinely confused, but I think that Dani made it perfectly clear to Kane that she didn't want it, and he simply refused to listen. I see him as a rapist, plain and simple. But everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

[msf]

As far as dressing provocatively goes, she was wearing a sleeveless shirt, as pretty much all the characters do.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If it's less than 25 degrees it's provocative, was it more than 25 ?

[Krazy Karl]

Krazy Karl, you say that Kane mistook Dani's flirting for more, and believed that she wanted to have sex, so how is that rape???  Rape is when the person knows that the other one doesn't want sex, but forces it upon them anyway, using physical force, weapons, or threats.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How can I call that rape... because he didn't take the time to find out if she wanted it. He would have been in control the entire time, and she probably said no, but even if she didn't, he didn't take the time to find out.

Maybe everyone should carry around contracts, and before sex takes place, both parties have to sign it

[Ashirr-Leigh]

I know how you feel, Claire Louise    I feel like I've seen this argument a hundred times before as well on various H&A forums...

Reluctant though I am to bring the situation up again, there are a few things I'd like to point out.

The trouble with the word "consent" is that it is difficult to define in rape cases. People don't generally sign forms consenting to the act before having sex, consent is usually assumed when both people carry on and don't make any vocal or physical objections. Kane could not read Dani's mind, and unless she actually forcefully told him no, and he was required to physically restrain her in order to go through with the act, that one cannot really blame him, or accuse him of "rape".

What we saw of the storyline was Dani very obviously flirting with Kane, dressing provocatively, inviting him into the house, and then bringing him up to her bedroom. What happened from there was unseen and had to be figured out based on the erspective character's accounts after the event.

There is a clip from the episode where Kane raped Dani on kaneandkirsty.com. Kane had helped Dani to carry in the shopping. He started to kiss her and she pulled away. He grabbed hold of her again and she immediately started shouting at him and stop it and get away from her, sounding very frightened, before the screen faded to black. She definitely told him 'no' forcefully. They were in the kitchen; she certainly hadn't invited him up to her bedroom. As far as dressing provocatively goes, she was wearing a sleeveless shirt, as pretty much all the characters do.

Personally, I can't see how anybody could think that what Kane did to Dani wasn't rape, or that he could in conscience assume that she consented. I know there are many cases where both parties are genuinely confused, but I think that Dani made it perfectly clear to Kane that she didn't want it, and he simply refused to listen. I see him as a rapist, plain and simple. But everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I remember watching that episode so when someone said that she hadn't said no and that Dani had invited Kane up to her bedroom, I got confused.

Everyone is getting sick of this argument now but it gets really frustrating when people still can't accept the fact that Dani was raped by Kane.

[Si-Co]

We are all assuming that Tammin was quoted word-for-word and in context in the DS article.

[shahhnun]

Argh, not this argument again! Noooooo!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My thoughts exactly! From the first post on this thread I get the impression that Sam & Tammin did film more to that scene than was shown on TV. Maybe we should ask Seven to show the cut scenes to solve the arguement once & for all !!!!!

And, yeah, Si-Co has a point - it wouldn't be the first time what an actress said would be printed out of context....

[Natalia]

Well, by all cast and crew accounts, it was supposed to be rape - regardless of how much of it was shown on television.

It's insulting to rape victims (I know two) when people try to play down the severity of any kind of sexual assult. No matter how Dani acted prior to that day, it is disgusting that there are young women here saying, "she got what she deserved". Grow up guys.

[MarMar]

Well, by all cast and crew accounts, it was supposed to be rape - regardless of how much of it was shown on television.

It's insulting to rape victims (I know two) when people try to play down the severity of any kind of sexual assult. No matter how Dani acted prior to that day, it is disgusting that there are young women here saying, "she got what she deserved". Grow up guys.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I absolutely agree with you.

And, you should not forget rape between partners.

[Jay Preston]

I personally love this debate. I think it's fantastic that so many people continue to be wrong

I enjoy this debate so much, and I want to comment on this:

Rape is when the person knows that the other one doesn't want sex, but forces it upon them anyway, using physical force, weapons, or threats.

I'm not sure that's completely accurate. I'm not sure what *is* accurate, but it's not that. I think that someone can rape someone without knowing exactly what they're doing, or at least realising too late. We were expected to believe this in the Kane story anyway since it was an important part of his redemption.

But even if the perpetrator isn't fully aware, the pain of the victim is just as real as if it happened in an alley at night with a stranger. No matter what the perp thinks, the victim's trauma is just as real and just as powerful.

In fact, I've read that date rape (which is what I would consider the Kane/Dani situation to be) is a crime of unique cruelty - even worse than if it was a stranger. Of course this is just opinion of some survivors and I've never been in this situation, so I can't say this with certainty, but I think some people (Kane fans inparticular) need to be aware of this possibility.

Kane *did* rape Dani. He didn't realise, but Dani did. No matter what you think of Dani, whether or not her actions towards Kane prior to the rape were appropriate, that doesn't change the fact that her pain was real, that she was deeply traumatised by what he did to her and it took her a long time to get over it, but to her credit she did manage. And he ended up becoming decent (in a way) too.

And I think this may have been what Tammin found frustrating about this storyline. The extent of Dani's trauma could not be revealed properly because she couldn't say to us that she'd been raped because of the G classification. Perhaps as a woman she wanted to make sure this story was done right - and it really wasn't from her perspective. And her character suffered because of it. I can understand that this would be annoying to her.